Silly Things People Have Said to Me When I Tell Them I’m Not Having Kids
There will be no children in my future. Ever.
Yes, I am married. Yes, my husband knows that I do not want children. Yes, we both realize we’re extremely fortunate to be able to elect to live childfree. He doesn’t want kids either. It’s part of the reason I married him. (That, and he has excellent hair.) He married me knowing that and also because I always clean the litter box.
I probably brought up the topic of kids on the second date — it would have been a deal breaker. My husband would make the world’s greatest father. But that alone isn’t reason enough for me to become the mother I’ve never wanted to be, to take on a crushing financial burden or to add more to my already too-full plate.
I love my friends’ children. Because I don’t have to take care of them. Their cuteness is there to fulfill my need to see cute things. I don’t expect them to behave for me, and they don’t expect 18 years of dinner from me. I see this as a good setup.
Not only do I not want children, but I think what really blows people’s minds is that I’ve realized I don’t need them. Apparently some people agree with me, and apparently that’s national news if the August 12, 2013 issue of Time magazine is any indicator: The entire cover story was dedicated to the marvelous epiphany that “having it all” — whatever that even means — for some Americans means not having children. We’ve come far as a country, haven’t we, when a well-established journalistic bulwark recognizes that — gasp — married couples might actually chose to subvert the cultural paradigm and elect to never need a minivan! What’ll they come up with next?
I love my friends’ children. Because I don’t have to take care of them. Their cuteness is there to fulfill my need to see cute things. I don’t expect them to behave for me, and they don’t expect 18 years of dinner from me.
Gay people having babies? What sorcery is this?
Listen. I’m being real here: I need my sleep much more than I need children. Does that sound selfish? That’s probably because it is! Which is probably one of the top reasons I shouldn’t enter into parenthood in the first place. Which is just so funny because people who have no business being in my business say the darndest things when I tell them I’m not having children. A sampling:
“You should totally do it! It’s a blast!”
I bet having a dog is also a blast, but I don’t even want the responsibility of caring for a dog. You’d probably talk me out of having a dog I didn’t want to care for, so why would you try to talk me into having a human being I don’t want to care for?
“You’ll change your mind.”
This is one of my absolute favorite things that people like to say when I tell them I’m not having children. It’s so funny because it implies they know me better than I know myself. To which I like to respond, “HOORAY! A REAL LIVE FREE PSYCHIC! What else can you tell me about myself that I don’t know? Will I win the lottery? Will I ever finally lose ‘those last stubborn five pounds’ or should I just give up. Also, how will the final season of Mad Men end?? Will we ever find out what really happened on the final scene of ‘The Sopranos’? What other secrets of the universe are you hiding in that magical brain of yours?”
“But what will you do when you’re old?”
Um, let’s see… hopefully spend the savings account that I didn’t drain on summer camp and braces and college on traveling the world, all while dressed like Bea Arthur in the Golden Girls. Playing shuffleboard. Hopefully.
“You’ll just figure out a way to afford it.”
LOL. Oh GOD you are just the funniest thing! Truly, a hoot! You’re a stand-up comic, right? What’s funny about that bullshit is that someone probably shared the same Pollyanna-ish platitude with the millions of people in this country who couldn’t afford kids when they started out and still — even with college educations and decent jobs — never managed to “just figure out a way to afford it.” The other thing that’s funny is that this is another of the benefits of not having kids: you never have to figure out a way to afford it.
“But what if you regret never having your own kids?”
I’d rather regret never having children than have children and regret it.
“But you’ll never know happiness like the happiness of being a parent.”
I’ll also never know what it’s like to have a penis. Or be Cuban! Or be able to dunk a basketball on the 1992 Olympic Dream Team. I’ll also never know what it’s like to change a fetid diaper or what it’s like to have a teenager who devotes months if not years to hating me, followed by decades of passively resenting me. Thank you for your genuine concern regarding the status of my happiness, Deepak Chopra, but as a genuinely content person, I’m living proof that happiness isn’t just reserved for parents and that it’s possible to know happiness without venturing into parenthood. I love it here on the sandy childfree beach upon which I’m currently sunning.
“Why wouldn’t you want to have children if your body is capable of it?”
Yes, someone actually said this to me. My body’s also capable of having a gang bang, but I’m definitely not boarding that bus. So I’m not even honoring that with a response. The side eye was invented for this occasion.
“Good for you!”
Thank you. Can’t say I disagree.
This piece was originally published on October 8, 2013.
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Read more by Tamar:
- Can We Please Stop Talking About Kale Now?
- Mad Men and Office Politics: Different Era, Same Drama
- Five Non-Carb Gifts for Carb Lovers
- Women Who Inspire: Jonatha Brooke
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240 Responses
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Brian Minter But what about Jesus?
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Adrianna Dufay Good for you!
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Grace Gold THANK YOU.
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Tara Trainor Thank you so much!!!! I feel like I could have written that!! I am 48 now. Most people assume I had a medical problem. I chose NOT to have children and I am so thankful every single day!!!
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Ruth Dubb I’m 46 and childless. Not one single regret either.
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Caitlin Dohrenwend This is amazing! I don’t know why I’m still always impressed by you’re hilariously perfect choice of words. The. Best. Can you write more please
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Caitlin Dohrenwend I meant your!
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Melanie Powers It’s as if you’re in my brain! My reasons and thoughts exactly, except you’re funnier. LOL.
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Scott Well-written, funny and completely full of crap. If what you have with your husband is really such a great thing, then it’s only natural that you’d want it to grow and share it with others. If you have a solid partner and you love each other, why have kids? A few reasons not mentioned in your piece. Take on new life challenges together (your love for each other will be stronger), passing the torch (you have such a great thing, so pass on your wisdom and love to your offspring so they can do the same), or if those don’t float your boat – nature/biology (procreation is a survival guarantee that’s been baking into our brains since, well, for a very long time), it’s natural to procreate, and in the animal kingdom (where we humans came from IMHO) it’s a pretty important part of life!
I’m assuming of course you have a solid partner, love each other and can provide an enriching environment for kids to grow up in, which I it seems you indicate you can from your article. If you’re single and choose a no-kids no-marriage lifestyle, more power to you. But to marry, settle down with one person, and just not have kids….I think there’s something amiss.
So for the aforementioned married and/or in love people, what are the good reasons not to have kids? Population control. You live in an extremely over-crowded, poor area, where many kids don’t have a chance at a decent life. That I respect. You have too many problems of your own. Drug addict? Great, don’t procreate. Career criminal? Perfect, use rubbers. Can’t stay with one lover for very long? Awesome, stay single childless. For whatever reason (career maybe) you know you won’t take care of them? Again perfect, and good for you for knowing yourself that well. But your trying to paint the “we have a great life, so would our kids, my husband would be the world’s best dad, but we just don’t want any” picture, and I’m not buying it. If you would have said either you or your husband would make a completely crappy parent, I would have applauded your honestly, and probably not be writing this reply.
Kids don’t bankrupt you, diapers aren’t that big of a deal. It’s just another phase of life. It makes you stronger, your relationship stronger and even if they resent you for awhile, I think it’s better than clinking the same two wine glasses night after night. Also, think beyond yourself, your kids can play a part in shaping the future 🙂
And the best reason of all to have kids? If your parents had read an article like yours in their youth, and took it to heart, than poof! you wouldn’t have even been here to write yours 🙂
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Kris I bet Scott has children….who likely possess (or will, in the future) this same all-knowing, condescending, narrow-minded attitude. Lovely. Thanks for “passing it on”.
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Todd Scott…it’s too bad your parents didn’t read an article like hers in their youth, and take it to heart, than poof! You wouldn’t have even been here to write your idiotic reply! Oh well…too bad! 🙂
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Jordan Procreation is a survival guarantee? That is news to me.
“If your parents had read an article like yours in their youth, and took it to heart, than poof! you wouldn’t have even been here to write yours :).” That would only be true if she’s telling us *we* shouldn’t have kids, which she’s not. If her parents had read the such an article, it probably would have no effect on whether they had children.
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Nada Scott- you DON’T get it. Everyone does not want to be a baby-machine. Women have worth beyond our reproductive organs- which is the subtext of your argument- a woman without a baby is “not a real woman”. Lives of married couples are “empty” without living for someone else. A load of crap. There is nothing more selfish than having a child in this overcrowded world.
I work with at risk youth and I see far too many examples of parental abuse and neglect of kids from all races and walks of life. If someone does not desperately want to have children- then they SHOULDN’T- because they will be a terrible, resentful parent with damaged children.
And for the record, I know many people from poor communities, third world countries, single folks and gay couples who would be much better parents than I – so all parts of your argument are nil to a thinking person.And as for population control- yeah, we’re slowly committing suicide on a global level due to over population. We in the “first world” are the ones using most of the world’s resources and creating the most pollution and waste. So yes, even rich white people (like I assume you are) need to control the number of offspring they have as well, if they want the human race to survive.
As for me, I too am happily married for 10 years, together for 15 and WILL NOT HAVE CHILDREN. We like our friends kids, but we do not want any. There is nothing wrong with us. We are not animals that must procreate out of biological imperative without thinking. We are careful people, and are not part of the masses of sheep who have babies simply because that’s what they are supposed to do. We have careers, we travel, we experience life and our artistic/intellectual pursuits. Child-free and very full filled.
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Jordan “There is nothing more selfish than having a child in this overcrowded world.”
That is as ignorant and condescending as anything anyone’s said in this thread. Many people believe having children can lead to a joyful, fulfilling life. (for them, not for the original author of the article). Saying these people should be deprived of a fulfilling life with children is just as bad as saying the original author should be deprived of her chosen child-free life.
“So yes, even rich white people (like I assume you are)…”
He doesn’t sound that rich to me. Probably middle income or slightly better.
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ThisisJustCrazy ” Saying these people should be deprived of a fulfilling life with children”
Ever heard of adopting? Having your own child and adding to the thousands of children being born daily instead of adopting a child that needs a family and is alone is one of the most selfish things I can think of.
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gubmintworker “And the best reason of all to have kids? If your parents had read an article like yours in their youth, and took it to heart, than poof! you wouldn’t have even been here to write yours”
I’m sorry, that’s just lame. If her parents had never had her, then she would have had no brain to comprehend anything, childfree by choice, parents or otherwise. No one can ever explain to me how a person could care they were unborn if they were unborn and never a person.
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Nulligravida “And the best reason of all to have kids? If your parents had read an article like yours in their youth, and took it to heart, than poof! you wouldn’t have even been here to write yours [sic]”
It is bemusing the way Scott smugly intones this statement as if he is the first person in the childfree discussions on the interwebz to make this profound observation.
Scott, if my parents felt this way then you’d be arguing with them that your life choice was the only life choice. Clearly you are rather insecure and need self-affirmation or else you would not be defending your position. A a stranger’s refusal to have kids is a not a criticism of your choice to be a parent.
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Pria Mind your own fking business bitch! Poof!
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O07beeutee Okay?! Puh-LEEZE!
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Michelle Oh Scott. I understand that you are resentful of those of us who realize that there is indeed a CHOICE involved when it comes to having children. It must be hard being a Dad, losing your identity to become nothing more than little Johnny’s “taxi”. Hey, I hear ya! Also, I understand your wife and you have struggled through adversity to ensure your children have what’s best and you’ve damaged the love that was once there (as we know, statistics show that children cause increased stress on relationships and divorce is at an all time high). It also must be fun to go to 5 hour long dance recitals, watch your kid suck at soccer in the pouring ran and fork out money to buy them the latest Bratz doll. Keeping all of this in mind though, where do you come off telling us how to make informed life decisions?
I have been happily married for 7 years to the man of my dreams and we have a great life filled with intellectual stimulation, travel, friends and all the things I am sure you wish you had instead of hours of Sponge Bob, drooling offspring and headaches. I’m sure writing this post was liberating, I mean, it’s probably the only adult contact you’ve had in days, but remember this- you made the bed you lie in.
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karen Well said 🙂
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Jay Passing the torch? Geez, that’s a pretty lame reason.
And your whole “it’s animal natural” reasons are a hoot. One thing about humans is that they can make choices. It’s also natural to live outside and hunt/gather your own food – are you doing that? Don’t worry, humans are not going extinct — in fact it’s quite the opposite. The only real danger to humans are other humans. So why have so many humans running around? That’s dangerous!
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Hana Couldn’t have said it better myself!
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Beth Scott why would you care if she doesn’t want kids and is happy with that choice?
As a relatively happily married woman in her mid-thirties, who is choosing not to have kids, I relate to Ronnie and the annoyances of those to try to push their will on me. I say relatively, because no marriage is perfect and not every day is a total joy, but on the whole, we love, support and enjoy one another. We want change, but to us that is relocation, traveling or starting a business or charity, it’s not starting a family! Nothing is perfect in life. No matter what path you chose, there is no guarantee that you’ll always feel happy.
I just never felt an overwhelming call to motherhood. I like dogs and cats, staying up late and feeling carefree. I have no doubt that I’d love a child if I had one, but I’d probably love a mansion in Maui too…that doesn’t mean I should change my own life to get it.
I think from a young age, I realized that although my parents loved me, they had my sister and I too young. I think my father especially found it hard to be a parent. I could tell that there was a part of him that regretted marrying my mother and having us, despite his deep love for us.
Instead of being angry at him for feeling like that, I decided to consider why he may have been that way. The answer I came up with, aside from him being a troubled individual, is that in his day few people chose not to take the path of being married with children. He didn’t think there was another option, but fortunately in today’s world there is!
I could also make an argument that more people should chose not to procreate in the interest of global and environmental concerns. Humans in general to me, over value the important of their existence. Perhaps that is a discussion for another day, but I’ll summarize by saying this: in the grand scheme of the universe our individual life spans are truly nothing. So why do we think it’s so important to mark the earth with our presence? This is why I think a lot people have kids, because they foolishly believe it somehow immortalizes them. What they miss is that to be remembered is to have an impact. Having children in most cases, won’t make people remember you, and in some even more unfortunate cases even your own kids won’t think much of you. Don’t we all know someone with kids they have estranged relationships with? Only have kids if you really want the experience and are willing to devote yourself for life to another, because anything else is truly the selfish choice!
For example, my sister, a person who lived a life quite opposite of that of someone who wanted to be parent, is now at 41 and pregnant by a sperm donor. Yes we’re all supposed celebrate her independence and applaud her for her fearlessness, but I know that she just might be one of the world’s great narcissists!
In her twenties she worked hard and partied hard, that resulted in two abortions. In her thirties, she panicked that the right man wouldn’t come along. Seeing myself and her friends start to marry off, she set her mind to landing the first guy who said okay to her grand life plans. So she decided to marry a man 20 years her senior, with two teenage kids from another marriage (ps. he was still married when she met him) and who’d had a vasectomy. Now hearing that you’d probably think, she didn’t want to be a mother, but in fact according to her, she always really did. So they planned on having a reverse vasectomy and started the process of IVF. 4 years and 4 IVF”s treatments later, their marriage crumbled. Within months of separating, she got a sperm donor and is now due to have a baby girl in a few months.
Now I don’t mean to sound harsh, because she is my sister and I love her and I’m excited to have a niece, but when I think of how stupid her path to motherhood has been, it angers me. I wonder what my niece will think in years to come when she asks about her father. I also wonder if my sister won’t unintentionally put a lot of pressure on this kid to be the miracle that will fulfill her life. How is that for a mind f**K?
And if the child is just average, maybe even troubled….will my sister regret this path? One thing I know for sure, even if she does, she’ll never admit! Her ego is too huge to admit that she didn’t know what she was doing! Not to mention, it is still unknown if IVF treatments can lead to cancer or other aliments later in life. Plus with the incredible amount of money she spent on this, she could have adopted and helped to stop hunger!
All this only confirms my desire to stay childfree! Maybe I will regret it one day, but I don’t think so. I plan on living to the fullest and letting the chips fall where they may. I’m okay with not planning every moment in life and leaving some things up to chance. Plus, I’m thankful that I won’t have a someone else telling me I ruined their life!
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Narelle “If what you have with your husband is really such a great thing, then it’s only natural that you’d want it to grow and share it with others”. What, so if what you and your wife and your kids have is so great, you would bring others into your relationship, like swingers or something?
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dad Wow… Scott is not an insecure fellow or anything…
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Its ok your life choice was fine too.
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Moira Scott, you are one of the aforementioned “having no business being in her business” folks. What IS complete crap is to believe that you *must* want to procreate! just you have a happy solid marriage. If she doesn’t want children, she doesn’t want children. Simple. It would be far worse if she went ahead and had them anyway! Can you think of much worse for a child than growing up knowing s/he was never wanted?! I’m not talking about someone having kids, then turning out to be a crappy parent, but who genuinely never having even wanted them in the first place.
Better to know straight out that you don’t want kids, than ruin their lives – and yours – by going ahead and having them anyway. There are enough kids in the world who aren’t looked after properly! Some people are just smart enough to know, beforehand.
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Scott This is a blog right? You’re putting your comments “out there” for people to read. Publicly. If you only want people to slap you high-five then maybe you should make this blog private? I found it, read this piece, and responded with what I thought/felt. I do apologize if this isn’t the forum for replies that aren’t all saying the same thing.
I also apologize for saying your article was full of crap, that was harsh! Your article is well-written and your sarcasm is spot-on (being honest). Let’s just say I scrutinize the notion that happily married couples who don’t want kids have a good reason for not wanting kids. I would consider good reasons some of the reason I mentioned, to sum it up for one reason or another you would make a crappy parent or your kids’ lives would be very difficult – then I applaud you not having kids. The same way I applaud bad drivers for taking the bus. But to say your loving husband would make the greatest dad in the world, and you just like to sleep in too much, and so you just don’t want kids, that’s suspect to me. That’s like saying if I took the time I could win a gold medal in the Olympics in swimming, but nah I just don’t wanna, cuz I like to watch TV too much.
Also…
I will never own a minivan
I love my friends’ kids
I love my sleepKids are an adventure. What couple in love doesn’t want an adventure? Also, in a sense, kids are NBD too. It’s a lifelong commitment and a lot of work, but name something truly worthwhile that isn’t? Pablo Picasso was a stillborn baby, and Albert Einstein didn’t talk until he was three. So throw out any preconceived notions you have of what having kids “should” be like…
Diapers are seriously NBD…and you may have to change your parents’ diapers when they get old, so kids are good practice at the very least!
Anyway do whatcha like! I’m sorry if I offended anyone by posting a thought different than the author’s. I guess I’m just narrow-minded, condescending and all-knowing? I’m not usually an advocate for kids this intensely(!), or at all, I just like to debate and this article for some reason struck a chord with me…
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Rei Would you spend your entire life studying snowflakes? Probably not. Because while one guy thought that was totally worthwhile, not everyone agrees. And if you think changing a baby’s diaper is anything like changing an adult’s diaper, you are in for a rude awakening unless you’re Batman.
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Nulligravida “Kids are an adventure.”
If a third degree tear in a place that I would never want stitches is called “an adventure” then why are there no “Permanent Urino-Genital Dysfunction” adventure tours?
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Ruth Dubb Scott, you had every right to disagree with the original posting. And people have the right to disagree with your reply. People disagreeing with you does not mean the blog should have been private
If anything you actually provided more fodder for the article; silly things people say to couples who opt not to have children. Practice for changing our parents’ diapers? The chance of having an Einstein or Picasso? One could also have a Ted Bundy or Adolf Hitler.
Not everybody has the need to procreate. Obviously you did. Despite our success as a species population-wise, the human race is notable for its relatively low offspring output in relation the the frequency with which we copulate. In other words, most of the sex that human beings are having does not lead to children. I submit that we don’t have a need to procreate so much as a need to forge social bonds. Who says those bonds must lead to children?
Jumping out of an airplane is an adventure too. You pick your adventures. Let other couples pick theirs.
One can be an advocate for kids without having to make more of them. Rest assured plenty of couples, happy or otherwise, rich or poor, are having children. Nobody should feel obligated to have children just because they are in a happy relationship or prosperous. Laziness is an excellent reason not to have children. It’s honest too.
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Andi See, here I was thinking that NOT WANTING CHILDREN was a perfectly good reason to not have them!! But, now I have to be able to rationalize my decisions to everyone who knows me better than I obviously know myself. Look, some people just don’t want them. It has nothing to do with the strength (or lack thereof) of their relationships, they just don’t want kids, and their reasons why are not for anyone else to judge.
The reason everyone is jumping on you is because you’re proving the author’s point – WHY should we have to justify our decisions to you? Because we’ve somehow avoided the cultural indoctrination that everyone around us is following? How is what an individual does or does not do with their body ANY business of anyone’s, except their own (and that of their partner, in this case)
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Jay Your offense was not that you posted a different “thought” than the author’s — it was telling her that she was flat out wrong and that you had the answers.
“Kids are an adventure”? Gee, that’s a great reason. You know what else is an adventure? Spending a summer in an African village helping to dig a well, so that the children there could have clean water for once.
Having kids is not for everyone, just as getting married or becoming a dentist isn’t. Adults are allowed to make their own decisions based on their own circumstances, goals, and philosophies. Maybe if more people thought about the commitment, costs, and possible let downs of having kids (like when they hate you in their teen years and then leave the house at 18 and shutdown all communication), then we’d have a smaller but happier/healthier population.
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Sara I am still not understanding your point against happily married/partnered, stable and able couples not having children — why is it so “suspect”? Suspect of what exactly?!
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Julie Scott, you’re entitled to your opinion… but you DO know that stillborn means the baby is dead right? Which would make your Picasso argument moot “Pablo who?”
No, they only THOUGHT he was stillborn, which is not an adventure, it’s a nightmare, and not a way to convince anyone that they’re missing out.I really appreciate how well-worded, and spelled your responses have been though 🙂
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lawngnomejack Scott, are you suggesting that couples who say they don’t want kids, but not for the reasons you find acceptable, are just deluding themselves? As if, because our reasons are superficial, we actually want kids but are in denial? Now that’s a ridiculous notion.
Couples who know that they don’t want kids and who genuinely would rather spend their time doing what they want would make very bad parents. Or rather, they could be very good parents (if they chose), but inside they would be depressed, horrible people who resent the fact that they have children because they have given over their hard-won freedom to child-rearing. And the child might get a sense of this. Or, if they don’t, why should I sacrifice my own mental and emotional well-being to have children that I don’t want? Why is the existence of a person who shares part of my DNA more important than the happiness of a person that already exists (me)? I don’t find that a good trade. This should be reason enough to not have children (even though, really, you don’t need a reason).
And I guarantee that there are things that you could be good at that you don’t do because you don’t enjoy them. I was good at French, but I didn’t major in it. I hated it, so I dropped it as soon as I was able to in tenth grade. Why should attitudes about children be any different? They should be even more strict because the life of the child would be affected. If I had continued my French education, the only person who would suffer would be me.
And if you ever think that I would change my parents’ diaper you have another thing coming. That is what long term care (or home care) is for, and since I didn’t spend my money on kids, I may be able to afford home care or at least one of the nicer long-term care facilities.
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SK Oh my god, stop! How many analogies will it take to get through to you that different people like different things? Like, for some medicine is a life calling, but that won’t compel the rest of us to become physicians. Secondly, why is what one woman chooses to do with her time, money, and body up for debate? She doesn’t owe any further explanation for why she doesn’t want kids beyond, “I don’t want them.” And if we do happen to offer our reasons at the behest of people like you that just refuse to get it, the appropriate response is not to attempt unconvincing us of our own convictions. It took me a decade of serious thought to realize parenthood isn’t for me, and I doubt the sorts of people that push their one-size-fits-all idea of a well-spent life come to their decisions with as much self-awareness and intellectual scrutiny. Think of something you really don’t enjoy, or are afraid of, or are just simply ambivalent to, maybe even something you tried out and still didn’t like, and imagine having to do it for the next 18-25 years because someone who was really into that thing successfully talked you into it. You’re that guy.
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Chauncey Nicole Smith Sandy child-free beaches are my jam (except Sandals – womp womp). Thanks for not subscribing to the belief that we must somehow justify our existence by signing up for a double-decade migraine. I am okay with the peace and quiet. Really. I’m also okay with you not bringing your child to the office. Ever.
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O07beeutee …..maybe there are people in the world who just DONT LIKE KIDS and all the time energy and expense.
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What happened to “live and let live?”
Why are some breeders so hostile?
I said it. BREEDERS. Now go off on that.-
Lucy Some women don’t have the urge to have children, that’s their choice. I knew I wanted children by my early 20s and am having my second child, wouldn’t trade them for the world. Unfortunately men don’t understand the maternal instinct or lack there of. Most men have the urge to reproduce, just like Scott said, and some don’t. Just because he is pro children and has strong agreements towards it does not mean he should be attacked by nonparents’. It is a preference thing. And as far as the over population problem, look at the statistics, African Americans hold the highest obesity rates, medical needs, and more children than whites or non Hispanic whites. And from people I have talked too, they don’t want the uncertainty of being denied an adoption, or loosing the important years of the child growing from infancy into a toddler. Some people are okay with adoption but sometimes the kids by toddler age are already psychologically messed up in the head, it depends on the child.
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Scott FYI, I was kind of taken aback at the hateful replies I’ve gotten by posting a different point of view. To those people who’ve insulted or said hateful things 1) Shame on you, this is a blog, and we should celebrate our differences (and different points of view) 2) Reminder of this sites Editorial Policies…
Be respectful of other points of view
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Kris The reason you are getting so many “hateful” replies is because your original comment makes huge unfounded presumptions (ie: if a married couple, who can afford it, does not want children, they must not actually be happily married and/or must not have the potential to be good parents) about the marriages of others, of which you know absolutely nothing about. People tend to react this way when others make sweeping generalizations which are critical of things of which they know nothing about. The entire tone of your comment is ‘I know best’ regarding the state of other individuals’ marriages, based solely on the fact that they may decide not to have children.
It’s interesting to me that you can have so little self-awareness as to be baffled by the fact that people do not like when strangers (who know nothing of the details of those individuals’ personalities or relationships) judge/criticize their relationships.
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Scott I think you are the one making huge, unfounded presumptions about me, namely I’m narrow-minded, condescending and all-knowing. And my kids will likely be narrow-minded, condescending and all-knowing too, because of me? So, from my reply to the author’s article you can draw some major conclusions about my kids and I? But I’m presumptuous? And you’re not all-knowing? My “passing it on” point in my original reply had to do with the positive aspects of parents/personalities, if you care to go back and read it 🙂
I didn’t state anybody had a bad marriage, or would be crappy parents, that didn’t cross my mind…or my keyboard.
I stated my opinion, and yes it had an all-knowing tone at times, and I apologize for that, but I also used phrases like “I’m assuming…” and “I think…” and “IMHO” (which stands for, by the way, in my honest _opinion_!) which are clearly indications it’s my opinion I’m stating as well.
The author posted a light, humorous piece, and I certainly attacked it without cause. But underneath the humor, and underneath my tone, I think there is an interesting topic, that can be discussed without insults or presumptions. My second post tried to do that, but I’ll probably never get past the tone of my first! Such is life.
“if a married couple, who can afford it, does not want children, they must not actually be happily married and/or must not have the potential to be good parents”
That’s your interpretation of my point, but I think you missed it. Here is my point: If a married couple, who have the means to provide a safe, healthy, stable environment for kids, (and have no glaringly obvious reasons not to have kids), decide not to just “because they don’t want to”, I can’t help but wonder why. And I would be willing to bet, that if they examined their reasons closely, they might find that there’s actually no reason not to, and they wouldn’t regret it if they did.
I could be dead wrong. This is just my opinion based on my life experience thus far.
Underneath all the fabulous humor, the author’s point is (my opinion here): she doesn’t want/doesn’t have time/is too selfish (that’s her word choice) to have kids.
What if you told a good friend there was an amazing place to go for a vacation, but they said no, because they didn’t want to go, didn’t have time to go, or were too selfish to consider going? Would that sit well with you so you’d drop it immediately, or would you make one more case for convincing them to go? I guess that’s where I’m coming from. I would try and make a case. And eventually, if that person clearly had no interest in the vacation, I would drop it, and move on.
And I realize the author and I are strangers, as opposed to good friends who recommend vacation spots to each other, but this is the internet. And this is a public blog. It connects people who would otherwise be strangers, and I hope it continues to do so. The open exchange of thoughts and ideas is a wonderful thing, even if people disagree!
So I guess I’m saying, in general as my opinion, examine yourself closely and carefully before making big decisions. And to take it one step further, as long as you can provide the right kind of environment, having kids, though it’s one major commitment, isn’t as big of deal as you might think, and is most definitely worth any inconvenience it comes with. Something like that. And again, I don’t go around preaching this to _anybody_, ever, except this blog since last night! And I don’t plan on becoming a fixture here, so don’t worry 🙂 This is solely a result of my stumbling across the author’s original post.
It’s interesting to me that you can have so little self-awareness as to be baffled by the fact that people do not like when strangers (who know nothing of the details of those individuals’ personalities or relationships) judge/criticize them or their kids….I admit my original tone was over-the-top, but I doubt it deserved insults at my kids, or any of the other hating comments 🙂
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Tanith If a couple does not want children, for whatever reason, then they are unlikely to be good parents. Having no passion for something, whatever that something may be, is not conducive to being accomplished at it.
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So yes, there is a reason why people who don’t want children would make poor parents, and that is because THEY DON’T WANT CHILDREN. Whatever reasons lie beyond that are both superfluous and no one’s business but their own.-
Pj /thread
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Nulligravida “Vacations” are fleeting and temporary whereas as parenthood, as I understand it, is permanent. I would not convince a person who wanted to have kids not to do so and insist that they should not any more than I would insist that a person who did not want to have kids that they should.
Scott, your comments were acerbic and haughty. That is why readers have taken umbrage. Had you said “I like parenting and I am cool with those who do not want to go there…” then perhaps you would have been better received.
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J Marie Scott, there is a HUGE difference between a vacation spot and a child. A vacation ends after a few days or weeks and you go back to your everyday life. A child IS for life.
My husband and I have been very happily married for 10 years. We, like the author, have no desire for children. We love each other very much, but know that our genes should never, ever mix. We would probably be adequate parents, and neither of us dislike kids, but we have no desire to be parents. It has no bearing on our marriage, or us as people.
We love adventure. My husband is in the military, and that lifestyle is an adventure in and of itself. I work at a large zoo. Our life is one huge adventure- and it’s enough. We’re fulfilled the way we are and like our life and each other’s company as is. If kids are for you, Scott, and you love being a dad, that’s fantastic, but there was really no need to go looking for holes in the author’s argument when she stands by her choice.
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Nicole Why should a couple HAVE to justify their decision not to have kids to you?
How is it any of your business?
How does it negatively affect you?
How does it negatively affect anyone else?
Why must everyone be made to have children whether they want to or not? You are operating under the assumption that having children is the default life choice and anyone who does differently must answer to others.“I don’t want to have kids” is a completely valid reason to not have kids. Why are there so many people who have a problem with people who choose not to have kids? Having kids may have been the right decision for you but that doesn’t mean that it’s the right decision for everyone. Everyone has the right to choose their own path as long as they are not harming others, and choosing not to have children does not harm anyone else at all.
I would never try to convince someone to get a pet DOG that they don’t want, so why do you think it’s okay to try and make couples have KIDS they don’t want?
Don’t you think that all children deserve to be born to parents who ACTUALLY WANT THEM? I do, and that’s why I don’t want any kids. Kids just don’t interest me. If I was forced to have kids, they would have full time nannies from the moment they were born until they were old enough for boarding school, then when they were 18, they’d leave home for good. I would be a cold, distant, resentful mother. I don’t hate kids, I just don’t find them fascinating or particularly pleasant to be around and I’m certainly not interested in risking my health just to incubate a child I am not interested in raising. Not only would it make me miserable, the child would suffer emotionally. Apparently I care more about the welfare of children than you do.
I also resent the implication that I somehow owe it to society to have children. Humans reproduce prolifically. For every couple who chooses not to have children, there are hundreds of millions of couples who will have 1-4+ children, especially couples who are religious, lower income or from Asian/African/Latin American backgrounds. So what’s the panic about? The human species is not going to become extinct anytime soon, and if it does, it won’t be the fault of childfree couples. The difference childfree couples make in population growth is negligible.
To conclude, as a woman who would have to endure pregnancy, childbirth, breastfeeding and the bulk of childcare duties (since it’s unlikely I will ever have enough money for nannies/boarding school, and even if I did, I’d rather spend it on something more worthy), the burden of responsibility would belong to me, therefore I get to decide whether I want to have kids and my answer is NO.
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Jordan “So I guess I’m saying, in general as my opinion, examine yourself closely and carefully before making big decisions.”
Why do you assume she hasn’t examined everything closely and carefully?
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Nicole Jordan: He obviously believes that having children should be the default and that she’s making a mistake by not having kids. Scott wants to push his lifestyle choice on others because he’s insecure and arrogant.
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Tamar Anitai Hi Scott.
You’re right — we’re complete strangers, and probably our ideological
differences range from slight to wildly divergent depending on the
topic. Honestly? I’m not offended that you called me full of crap.
That’s the risk you run when you put your words and thoughts on the
Internet — anyone with a keyboard may accuse you, and/or your writing
of having the street value of not much more than your basic fart. My
right to share my thoughts, your right to share yours.I think you may have taken some things out of the piece that weren’t
necessarily there. Our reads were different, but then again I was
sharing more sentiment than fact, so there’s more room for
interpretation. I don’t feel the need to defend myself, but if you
were wondering, there’s nothing amiss in my marriage (as far as I’m
aware!). Not having kids isn’t some kind of a marital coverup. We’re
committed, highly functioning (er, I think?) adults who love each
other. We just don’t think it’s our duty to procreate. Really.Again, you and I probably don’t have too much in common, but I
actually do respect the fact that you took the time to read my
thoughts and then share your own. I appreciate the fact that, even
though we’re complete strangers, you were concerned enough to
encourage me to think carefully about my actions. Believe me, I have,
but again, it’s somehow comforting to know a complete stranger gives a
shit! It’s a nice little reminder that we don’t exist in the lonely
belly of a vacuum after all. I completely agree: the open exchange and
the fact that technology and instant connectivity allows us to do that
is one of the best things about the Internet. That and cat videos.One thing on the Internet that I truly can’t stand is the kind of hive
mind that can form on point-of-view sites, when and where an audience
instinctively, almost blindly agrees with a writer or with the top
poster. Don’t get me wrong — I LOVE when people agree with me. It
feels almost as good as sleeping in. But I also love when people do
their own thinking (the subtext of this entire piece is that I did
thinking of my own) and I really do respect the fact that you’re not
afraid to think for yourself and that you shared a differing opinion,
which isn’t always an easy thing to do. Especially when you’re the
lone voice of dissent.This is a brand-new community and one that I feel fortunate to be
joining in its infancy. I hope that you’ll continue to stay here and
share your voice and views. I like learning and hearing from people
different from me, and it sounds like you do, too. I hope you’ll share
a little bit about yourself — where you’re from, how you found this
article, and what your experience has been like as a parent. The ups,
downs, joys, surprises, money-saving tips for affording diapers and
the like.This isn’t my site — just my story, But I do hope you’ll stay a while
and this community, which I hope is what this becomes, will embrace
you, regardless of your differing opinion.Best,
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Tamar-
Whooday But, what if he chooses not to fart?
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Carey Scott, the point of the article I think is that she KNOWS she doesn’t want kids. Whatever the reasons she gives, they are not yours to question. And comparing kids to a vacation is not a good analogy, IMO. Cause kids are definitely NOT anywhere NEAR a vacation. I am 44. I am childless by choice. I get these arguments as well, and don’t you think, as grown women, who get asked these questions; posited these theorem over and over and over since their early 20’s, that we might actually KNOW for REAL that we don’t want children? We’ve not only overcome the nagging, the questioning of our choice, our sanity, our purpose for living, but also have fought the inevitable biological clock. Believe me. When we know we don’t want kids, WE KNOW WE DON’T WANT KIDS. You talking about how it’s not that big of a burden, really (/snort) or being probably one of HUNDREDS to lob this argument at us is not going to change that.
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Michelle The constant questioning of women over this issue comes down to the fact that they are rejecting the social expectation of what it means to be a woman. The expectation is that women are not complete being unless they have children and it can be threatening to people (particularly men) when women refuse to maintain the status quo as it exists today. So, when they are questioning grown women about their choice to be childfree, they are really saying, “How dare you not have children? You’re not a “real” woman!”
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Jay Scott – you just don’t get it. Here’s what you just said above as a means of clarification:
“Here is my point: If a married couple, who have the means to provide a safe, healthy, stable environment for kids, (and have no glaringly obvious reasons not to have kids), decide not to just “because they don’t want to”, I can’t help but wonder why. And I would be willing to bet, that if they examined their reasons closely, they might find that there’s actually no reason not to, and they wouldn’t regret it if they did.
“I could be dead wrong. This is just my opinion based on my life experience thus far.”
Your statement is more than just an opinion. You are assuming to know more than the people who decided not to have kids. Just because someone can provide a safe environment does not mean they should have kids. If they don’t want kids, they should not have kids. There are many reasons for not wanting to have kids. Here are just two: they do not have the parenting instinct or desire to have kids that you seem to have; they want to experience life in a much different way (dedication to a fulfilling career; extensive world travel; continuous education — university, online, self-education; making art; volunteering, etc.).
If I can provide a safe environment to raise kids, then how many should I have? Is one enough? Must I have at least 2 so that they are not “lonely” and so they can love/hate each other? Maybe if I have a really safe home environment I should have a dozen. Am I being selfish if I don’t have as many kids as my wife can possibly pump out?
Your life experiences have led you down one path. Good for you. There are infinite paths to experience life. Many don’t involve having kids. Can you respect that?
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Jim People always ask me if I have children. I give a faraway look and say “Not anymore.” The problem is I’ve gotten old enough that it could simply mean they are adults now. So, I’ve had to add, after a pause, “The cats were allergic to them.”
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Kamille I just had to comment. THANK YOU for posting this.
I’m definitely doing the psychic bit next time someone says I’ll change my mind! 😉
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JK Read this and said hey….that’s my life! Both husband and I don’t want kids, we have 3 cats (I clean litter boxes too), and we look forward to a calm comfortable retirement on a beach! I plan looking good at 80…not tired!
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Kate I don’t care about you wanting kids or not, that’s your decision. But to have that kind of sarcasm and be that rude to people who ask you why or try talking you into it isn’t necessary. Yes it is rude of them to say some of the stuff they did but you don’t have to be rude back and say what you did.
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Ruth Dubb How was she rude and what did she say to people who asked her about kids?
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